OK, i screwed up and mixed the wrong fuel/oil ratio on the first tank of the break-in on my son's bike. I only put 1/2 gal. of fuel in the tank a couple days ago and only ran maybe a quart of it through the bike before i discovered the error. i am not too concerned about it but thought i'd ask the more experienced users your opinions.
Should i just leave it alone and continue the break-in with the correct mix or drain the tank? There should only be about a quart of fuel left in the tank. Correct me if i'm wrong, but i don't think there was enough of it run through the bike to do any harm. Your opinions and suggestions are appreciated.
BTW, i was using a standard measuring cup (i read the da*n thing wrong) but i now have ordered a Ratio Rite to help ensure i don't make the same mistake twice.
Actually that would be perfect.... and it's best to both breakin and run with the same ratio.... there's no real benefit to switching.
DB54, it would be good to know what ratio you are running but it's probably too late to matter. If it's way out of whack just throw it all out (at a proper dump of course, or put it in your lawn trimmer) and mix a fresh batch.
Actually that would be perfect.... and it's best to both breakin and run with the same ratio.... there's no real benefit to switching.
DB54, it would be good to know what ratio you are running but it's probably too late to matter. If it's way out of whack just throw it all out (at a proper dump of course, or put it in your lawn trimmer) and mix a fresh batch.
by my estimate, it is most likely a 20:1 I intended to mix it at 28:1 but got in a hurry, and discovered just today that i likely mixed 6oz. of oil to 1 gal. of gas but should have mixed 4.5oz. of oil to 1gal. This was the first time i had put any fuel in the bike.
A 20:1 mix will not do any harm at all . A bit too much oil for sure , but your engine will not mind the least bit . I've been running 2 strokes at 25:1 (5.2ozs/gal) for 30 years without a single siezure .
Simply mix up a fresh batch of fuel at your preferred mix ratio and add to the existing fuel left in the tank. No need to fuss with draining .
by my estimate, it is most likely a 20:1 I intended to mix it at 28:1 but got in a hurry, and discovered just today that i likely mixed 6oz. of oil to 1 gal. of gas but should have mixed 4.5oz. of oil to 1gal. This was the first time i had put any fuel in the bike.
Actually 2.6oz to 3.0oz would be better. We see pocketbikes in the shop all the time that run heavy oil mixtures. All they do is foul plugs and shorten their engine life with excess carbon buildup as well as it throws your jetting way off. Two-strokes need oil, but too much oil seems to do more harm than good and it hampers race performance.
The experts in minimoto engine tuning all recommend mixtures of between 40:1 and 50:1. That's what you should go with to maximize performance and engine life. If you just want to trim your lawn, 25:1 will be fine.
Finishing off your current tank probably won't hurt, but use less oil after that.
Actually 2.6oz to 3.0oz would be better. We see pocketbikes in the shop all the time that run heavy oil mixtures. All they do is foul plugs and shorten their engine life with excess carbon buildup as well as it throws your jetting way off. Two-strokes need oil, but too much oil seems to do more harm than good and it hampers race performance.
The experts in minimoto engine tuning all recommend mixtures of between 40:1 and 50:1. That's what you should go with to maximize performance and engine life. If you just want to trim your lawn, 25:1 will be fine.
Finishing off your current tank probably won't hurt, but use less oil after that.
tks RoboCop! and to all who replied. It seems as though at low idle, it wants to sputter a little but at higher rpms it seems to level out somewhat. Do i need to readjust the a/f mix or wait until i complete the break-in?
did you crack open the cylinder to check if it was a 43cc.because my bike has that two prong coil but i took off my cylinder and it turns out to be a 49cc
Actually 2.6oz to 3.0oz would be better. We see pocketbikes in the shop all the time that run heavy oil mixtures. All they do is foul plugs and shorten their engine life with excess carbon buildup as well as it throws your jetting way off. Two-strokes need oil, but too much oil seems to do more harm than good and it hampers race performance.
Sorry , but I have to take exception to your comments . If I were to pop the jug off my 2001 52cc decked, race ported Mitsubishi and take a picture of the piston crown , you would swear it's brand new . No carbon at all . I mix Redline Racing full synthetic at 25:1 . Further , one will never foul a plug due to a rich mixture . A fouled plug is typically indicative of incorrect (too rich) carb tuning . Folks confuse "rich" mixture with "rich" jet settings . Two totally different conditions .
As far as "shorter" engine life , I also own a 1961 25cc chainsaw that starts on the 2nd pull and has never had it's rings replaced .
In my humble opinion based on many years of building and tuning 2 strokes, there is no better ratio than 25:1 .
Sorry , but I have to take exception to your comments . If I were to pop the jug off my 2001 52cc decked, race ported Mitsubishi and take a picture of the piston crown , you would swear it's brand new . No carbon at all . I mix Redline Racing full synthetic at 25:1 . Further , one will never foul a plug due to a rich mixture . A fouled plug is typically indicative of incorrect (too rich) carb tuning . Folks confuse "rich" mixture with "rich" jet settings . Two totally different conditions .
As far as "shorter" engine life , I also own a 1961 25cc chainsaw that starts on the 2nd pull and has never had it's rings replaced .
In my humble opinion based on many years of building and tuning 2 strokes, there is no better ratio than 25:1 .
You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but the Italians, Spaniards and Brits with more than 60 years of combined experience in this sport humbly disagree with you.
In fact, everyone the world over, at the top of this sport runs somewhere between 40:1 and 70:1. Excess oil robs your engine of performance. It may not matter in certain two-stroke applications, but it does in two-wheeled road racing.
So I guess we'll have to agree to disagree... no need to belabor the point further, it's been beaten to death a couple dozen times on this site.
You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but the Italians, Spaniards and Brits with more than 60 years of combined experience in this sport humbly disagree with you.
In fact, everyone the world over, at the top of this sport runs somewhere between 40:1 and 70:1. Excess oil robs your engine of performance. It may not matter in certain two-stroke applications, but it does in two-wheeled road racing.
So I guess we'll have to agree to disagree... no need to belabor the point further, it's been beaten to death a couple dozen times on this site.
I agree ...This topic is overdone . Volumes have been written and folks will do what they believe is best anyway. With respect to the "Italians, Spaniards and Brits" , Zenoah , a world leader since 1910 in small 2 strokes from Japan recommends 25:1 ratio in all of thier high performance engines . http://zenoah.net/index.html
Last edited by Hotscoots : 11-08-2004 at 09:29 AM.
I agree ...This topic is overdone . Volumes have been written and folks will do what they believe is best anyway. With respect to the "Italians, Spaniards and Brits" , Zenoah , a world leader since 1910 in small 2 strokes from Japan recommends 25:1 ratio in all of thier high performance engines . http://zenoah.net/index.html
Hmmm, funny I haven't seen a Zenoah in any two-wheeled road races or championships yet....
I'm not sure go-ped engines apply to Minimoto or any two-wheeled road racing really, but you're welcome to bring one out to the track.
From the Polini site (I think they're bigger than Zenoah...in fact I think they're the largest small engine manufacturer in the world, close to it anyway):
"Q. What is the 2-stroke oil mixture?
A. It is 2%, which is 100ml, of good quality 2 stroke oil to 5 litres of fuel, 95 octane or higher."
2% is also 2.6oz of oil to 1 Gal of Gas or in other words, 50:1.
interesting input guys! i guess this topic could be debated for quite some time. as for your replies and info, i appreciate it alot. since my son will not be involved in any form of racing at this point and will only be using the bike for everyday pleasure, i do wish to have it run at it best and the info and input you guys have given will help me to do just that.
any other input from others will also be appreciated.
im no expert in this but it seems better to use the less oily ratio, 50:1. there are lots of posts here where people who have had these little buggers use the 50:1 or atleast higher than 25:1. a circa 1960's chainsaw motor, with all due respect, is not identical to a 2004 model year 2 stroke engine. back then they didnt have the newer forumulations in oil and sythentics that we have today. these newer oils allow us to get more out of our engines than would have been possible then.
again, no expert but just voicing my opinion also. didnt mean to beat this dead horse... ;-)
im no expert in this but it seems better to use the less oily ratio, 50:1. there are lots of posts here where people who have had these little buggers use the 50:1 or atleast higher than 25:1. a circa 1960's chainsaw motor, with all due respect, is not identical to a 2004 model year 2 stroke engine. back then they didnt have the newer forumulations in oil and sythentics that we have today. these newer oils allow us to get more out of our engines than would have been possible then.
again, no expert but just voicing my opinion also. didnt mean to beat this dead horse... ;-)
You are correct. While today's 2 strokes are identical to 1960s 2 stroke engine technology, synthetic oil will allow for leaner mixtures. How much leaner is entirely up to the individual .
Robo .... I concede that a fine Italian engine manufacturer would definately know and recommend the correct mix for thier own engine, however the engines on our Chinese Midbikes are much more akin to Zenoah engines than Polinni . I honestly don't know how big Polinni is , but Komatsu Zenoah's sales excede 600 million dollars. And Zenoah's recomendation could be based on the use of natural oils rather than synth. So, once again , the mix ratio is up to the comfort level of the user. If I were involved in competitive racing , I would absolutely risk a leaner mix to determine the results . I am a casual rider and have been enjoying 2 strokes since the early '70s. I have yet to sieze an engine , run cooler and seem to replace rings less often than those who opt for less oil. I guess I am in the "more oil is good" camp.
on the first tank of the break-in on my son's bike. I only put 1/2 gal. of fuel in the tank a couple days ago and only ran maybe a quart of it through the bike before i discovered the error. i am not too concerned about it but thought i'd ask the more experienced users your opinions.
you guys have been a big help.
