Great weekend of racing

What a GREAT weekend of racing at PIR. I was just wondering what some of your thoughts of the new track was. Because personally my son really liked the track and he enjoyed racing on it. I think it is one of the better tracks that we have had at PIR in the past year and a half.

I would like to give a big thanks to mark for everything he did this weekend in making it yet another great weekend of racing.

Tammy

I am grateful to everyone who participated and contributed to making this weekend's event happen.

Regarding the track...If the track stays the same, and I wasn't running for points, I would not return. My personal opinion is that it is the worst track I have ever ridden on. The left half of the track with the imitation "s" curves weren't really curves at all; they just prevented passing. It really took the form of an oval, and I would much rather race on something that has more than 2 turns. Then the track would provide some variability, challenge and fun. I asked some others what they though last night and they agreed that the wasted S turns could be made into useful turns. In thinking about different designs, given the amount and shape of the space provided, I believe that a great track idea would be the one that I saw in a Video of Valentino Rossi running on in Italy. It is totally doable and would not be dangerous to the novices. I can't draw, especially with a mouse. But it could look something like this...

Thank you for you input on the track. And for those of you who have so many negative things to say about the track next time the opportunity is there for in put about designing a new track make sure your there. Or someone has your ideas. there were four kids that spent there whole day drawing, thinking, and talking about how to design a new track that would be fun and safe for everyone to ride on. so next time please make sure your there or someone has your ides or in put on designing a new track as everyone who reads PBP knew that they needed help in designing and setting up the track on Friday. Thank you to those of you who did come out and help with the set up of the track it

This is what was posted on PBP this is how I found out about them needing help with the track.

Also, I don’t know if you guys heard, but we got the approval at the last board meeting to upgrade the track, making it bigger and a new configuration. They are being very supportive of the growing pocket bike program. We also got the go ahead to purchase meals for the volunteers that work the track in McMinnville. My mom has volunteered to set that up. More info on that to come.


Tony and I will be setting up the track Friday morning, if anyone can come out and help, it would be greatly appreciated, its about a 4 hour job so we will take all the help we can get.

While just an vested observer, the track could do with some more passing zones. The esses were tight, but it developed a new skill for the little guys. They hadn't been on a track before that you could straight-line with just a bit of bike movement with no body movement. I think it is a really good idea to keep in mind the need to keep the track plyable to keep developing rider skills. I consider this past weekend a sucess in that regard. Though it turned into a motor track, just like the big PIR track

As far as Track set up, I bet more people could help if it was done the evening before (Thursday eve for this coming PIR weekend) (Friday eve for other ones) rather then Friday mornings when most adults are working.

Would that be viable?

Thanks to all that made a weekend a great event. Mark...great...great...great...great...JOB!!!! I for one am very happy that there were no serious injuries and that the weather held out for all the races and the open practice (thanks again Mark!!!) was finished.

I am also glad to see the kids input on the track design as that will generate passion for racing!!!! One design was tried out now it's time to improve.

All of our Team would have loved to been there to help with track design but as Brian stated above we have a 4 hour drive to the track with jobs that require us there on Fridays and as in Christophers case Sat as well. Without working there would be no racing for us. I am very happy for the extra room granted from OMRRA and this will enable a safer and more challenging track. As a racer I could go through the s-curves as they were a straight line by looking and the last turn at the bathrooms. This then basically makes the track an oval with hp and gearing the deciding factor as I found out with our races and with my sons race. The track that Christoher laid out can be great challenging track. If anyone wants to see the video of Rossi racing it give me an email at nwminimoto@yahoo.com. Thanks, Mitch

I like Hackers idea! A fresh layout every weekend. It will add challenges like learning the track, bike set-up, gearing etc. It will teach the kids to adapt to new tracks quickly and improve performance when visiting out of town events.
Hopefully on the small PIR track rider weight and wind direction won't be a big issue!


I hope next time the track will be different.
Maybe we should have a contest to design a track between the racers only and then have everyone vote on their favorite design.
Doe's anyone know if there is a reason that we can't have a different track every race?

Thanks again![/quote]

I too immediately wondered why not a different track configuration each week since PIR isn't a permanent set up anyway. But then pondering longer I thought, well, the big tracks don't change. There's only a finite number of those tracks. The tricks are to learn them & gear for each individually.

When racers start out they learn different variations of corners: hairpins, sweepers, switchbacks, etc. If they only get to practice a particular corner for one weekend and then it's gone, they really haven't mastered that corner or skill. I think for kids dreaming of big bikes, keeping one tried course is the way to go.

Racing isn't about making the playing field even by creating a new track that no one has had the advantage of riding on. Racing has always been about gearing, horsepower and rider skill. To my own chargin - I think we should keep in that spirit of the 'game' like the big bikes.

Secondly, if we have a contest to design the track, that's fine. But when building a track there are safely issues to consider as to it's ridability. If you think of a horse jumping arena, those jumps are not placed willy nilly. They are specifically and deliberatly place to challenge the horse/rider in spacing out their strides - both long and short. I know pocketbikes don't have legs, but it's the best analogy I could come up with. That being said, I think presenting a new untried track each race weekend is not the best idea.

My son is currently looking at racing for the long haul, all the way up to big bikes. I'm sure many of the kids invision the same. I think keeping the track the same configuration is the best way to go. Whether or not the configuration from this week was the best choice is separate discussion then what I'm defending.

I realize mostly these are kids out there and I'm concerned with safety too. And I agree that the PIR track layout this weekend relied heavily on HP & gearing. But I tend to disagree with the chicane for passing and the hairpin as general track elements.

If a certain percentage of the riders were able to run a clean race and also a certain percentage of them being novice or not running a clean race, then I think that qualifies as a 'good track layout.' Not sure what the percentages should be. That would mean that the riders who did crash may have been pushing the bike beyond its limits, pushing beyond the rider's limits, or just not even experience with that type of set up and more seat time would give it to them.

A techinical track is much more fun to ride (IMO) then a HP one (many corners vs. mostly oval).

If PIR's track can provide some types of corner set ups that maybe other 'local' tracks don't have, that would be the ideal situation. Give riders a variety of skills to benefit from.

bwahahaha, I think the phrase you are looking for is "wind buffeting" and "winds from the West".

I too like the idea of changing the track layout. Maybe not every race, but maybe every other PIR race. You could even do the same with McMinnville, just run it backwards as Pops has let us do in the past. just and idea...

Cheers,


Mario Alvarez
AKA - Little Mario's Dad
www.younggunracer.com
"wide open 'til you see GOD...then BRAKE!!!"

I'd be in agreement to a different tried configuration each season.
I'm not in favor of every race or every other.

“I realize mostly these are kids out there and I'm concerned with safety too. And I agree that the PIR track layout this weekend relied heavily on HP & gearing. But I tend to disagree with the chicane for passing and the hairpin as general track elements.”

Hp and gearing? HAHA! Sorry, I must contain myself. A track with a 100 foot long straight and 2 turns is no test of hp and it isn’t much of a test for skill either.

“If PIR's track can provide some types of corner set ups that maybe other 'local' tracks don't have, that would be the ideal situation. Give riders a variety of skills to benefit from.”

This is the idea: McMinnville doesn’t change, neither do the other tracks that are fixed. But having the opportunity to redesign the track is something that could add an element of fun. For the adults, which are mostly is us Washingtonians, you might notice that less than half care to show up to Portland because it is a 4 hour drive to a terrible cone track. At least if we could work towards improving the track design, we may be able to entice them to start coming down for them. If the track situation at Portland does not improve, I fear that next year there may be very few adults who will be willing to drive down to race there.

When NWMiniMoto started organizing parking lot racing almost two years ago, we (usually I but Mitch too) designed new tracks on a weekly basis. I have a lot of experience designing tracks, have a couple hundred cones of various sizes that I could bring. I can also ensure that I would never make a corner setup that is either too challenging for a Novice (because of a lack of space), creates an unsafe passing situation, or gets bypassed because it is irrelevant to the ‘fast line’ around the track. For the next race day, I will be there early Friday to help setup and design, or the night before if possible, to make sure that we have a good track to work on. I would be happy to work with any parents or race officials to make sure that the combined effort provides for the design of a track that is a lot of fun and doesn’t compromise any safety standards.

If the corners are what everyone is so upset about then lets change them back to what we had to start with. We changed them because we had a few people say they were to sharp and it would cause a lot of wrecks as for the straight shorten it. I don't know what to say about the track but WE TRIED!!! The kids were very happy with what they did and I for one was very proud of them for even making the effort to take the time to do this. I guess you can not please everyone.

Don't get me wrong, I am very grateful for those who worked on the setup and design. I propose that those who are critical of the track design, show up to help setup and design something better. I would definetely be there.

I agree that its difficult to drive that far to set up the track, however, the 4 adults who took a day off work and worked 7+ hours in the heat (including 4 jr riders) to set up a track honestly took all of your concerns into consideration. I will talk to Mark Wiggington, the Track Director of PIR to see if we can get in to the pro pits July 14th, Thrusday night to set up the track.

Mark, the race director seemed happy with the track, he rode it the night before practice and its ultimatly his decision if the track is to change. Nothing can be changed with out his permission.

If Mark gives us the go ahead to re-do the track, all who are willing to help or want input on it, should show up and help set it up. I think this is the only way were going to get everyone's input and make a track most people will be happy with.

oooohhh if that were only true.... life would be soooooo much easier!
Just to clarify, I did not ride the track the nite before on a PB, i PEDDLED around it on a bike racing one of the kids (dang it, frustrates me I can't remember who!!) And for the record, my legs were BURNING after 2 laps, he was good to go for at least 10! Boy, getting old sucks...

anyways back to THE TRACK....
Early input I got from our experienced kids was that the track was sorta boring. By the end of the day they were telling me it was WAY fun! (Well, except for the bumps but we all know we cant do nutin' 'bout that). On sunday I did get a chance at a few laps on a PB. It really didn't ride out that much different than the "old" track, except for the added chicane. Yeap it was more challanging and physically demanding that McMinnville's speedway, but that doesn't make it bad or unsafe. Don't matter what the track is, if you're going in too hot, you're going in too hot.

There is never going to a track at PIR that is going to be perfect or a track ANYWHERE that will please everyone. I have no big problem with the current track. But as far as "permission" to change it... if the people that are ACTUALLY THERE DOING THE HARD WORK SETTING UP want to change it.... go for it! I haven't talked to him about it yet, but I'm betting Tony will be there to set-up. So if neither him nor I see any safety issues or problems with clearances.... it's all good!!!

Maybe what I meant to say wasn't HP, but rider weight.

I'm not a racer, only a casual rider.

Thanks Mark,
Have you seen the video of Rossi racing the track that Chris sketched out?

Hello all! I see mixed reviews here, which I believe, are a good thing. We pleased some, disappointed others. I do appreciate the hard work that was put into setting up the track on Friday, And Thank You for being there! Coming up with a new idea was the one thing I had the most difficulty with. Thanks to our junior riders that came up with the ideas we needed. You guy were Awesome! I think we all learned something about designing a track that day!

My big concern is safety first. So the track needed to have run off areas built in, weather they were big or small, and in key areas. I was looking to build in space between the corners and not have a situation where we have traffic separated by one cone width. Chris's drawing looks good on paper and I'd like to try it at PIR. I feel their needs to be room to separate the traffic flows. If we don't, we may see a rider get bumped from side of the cone into on coming traffic and have a head-on collision. I'm not going to approve of a track without some separation between the lanes. It's not safe in my mind. Chris's track could work very well and may be the ticket there. I say lets try it! I believe that once we do come up with something that allows for good competition, we should not change it for the season. We can learn the current setup or develop a new for the next race and look forward to something different next year. Please understand that I don't want the ultimate vote here. I really want more input to help work this out. I don't ride Pocketbikes, so I am not the one to make the absolute call on design. I do want a safe track that is fun for all.