Pocket Bike Forum - Mini Bikes

Go Back   Pocket Bike Forum - Mini Bikes > Pocketbike Tech Talk > Air Cooled Pocketbikes
Forum Home PBP Store Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts Mark Forums Read About Us
Pocketbike Pictures Pocketbike Classifieds Pocketbikes for Sale Member Map PBP Arcade Mark Forums Read

Pocketbike Forum
Site Sponsors



Top 10 Threads
Post up pics of your Cag...
Stock pipe mod
39 & 47cc CAG FAQ <-- READ TO AVOID PROBLEMS!
Boost Bottle?
NOS on my bike
Added a boost port tonight *pics*
Whats the fastest your bike ever went?
Port timing and size (area)
110cc, 4 stroke, 4 speed pocketbike!!!
Newbies, Read If You Want To Know What Is The Good Stuff....

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-27-2004   #1
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
carb intake porting photos


The first photo shows the stock intake. Pretty skanky.

The second photo shows the rough porting in progress. I used a grinding point on a drill press to evenly remove metal. I used lots of spray lube on the grinder and on the carb to keep the grinding smooth.

The third photo shows the finished rough grind. You can see how much metal was actually removed.

The fourth photo shows the finished carb. The rough grind was smoothed with 320 then 400 wet emory cloth to remove all scratches. Then it was given a quick polish with white compound.

The last photo shows close ups of before and after. The bore now merges smoothly with the lip.

Needle and jet adjustments are needed after this mod.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg stock.jpg (70.2 KB, 385 views)
File Type: jpg inprogress.jpg (65.9 KB, 445 views)
File Type: jpg rough.jpg (68.9 KB, 501 views)
File Type: jpg intakeported.jpg (50.9 KB, 397 views)
File Type: jpg close.jpg (61.7 KB, 536 views)
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004   #2
PBP RACER
 
Alienation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Age: 23
Posts: 81
i'm thinking about doin that with my carb, is it easy for a beginner to do it? and how much power did it give u?
Alienation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004   #3
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alienation
i'm thinking about doin that with my carb, is it easy for a beginner to do it? and how much power did it give u?
It's not that difficult, but it takes a couple of hours. The porting made such a huge difference that my jetting is way lean. I also had to move my needle clip one notch LEANER to get it started. Once I get things squared away, I'll post my impressions here.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004   #4
PBP RACER
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 71
Thumbs up

nice job man ...finally, some pictures to go along with the words. alot of people will find this helpful....make it a sticky..hahahaha. so you didn't drill through the passage to make it bigger throughout? did you do anything to the other side? i was going to use a 9/16" drill bit and drill through the carb to enlarge the intake then use the cone grinder to do what you did to enlarge the inlet. if this is all that's needed for improvements...then i'll just skip the drilling with the 9/16" bit and just do what you did. nice job again!
v6pwr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004   #5
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by v6pwr
nice job man ...finally, some pictures to go along with the words. alot of people will find this helpful....make it a sticky..hahahaha. so you didn't drill through the passage to make it bigger throughout? did you do anything to the other side? i was going to use a 9/16" drill bit and drill through the carb to enlarge the intake then use the cone grinder to do what you did to enlarge the inlet. if this is all that's needed for improvements...then i'll just skip the drilling with the 9/16" bit and just do what you did. nice job again!
Thanks v6pwr. I haven't bored through the carb yet. I figured the venturi would make the carb flow faster, so maybe boring through won't be needed. I would definitely bore it if I was running a high-rpm set up.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004   #6
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
badazztoyz.com's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Age: 30
Posts: 2,761
good work
badazztoyz.com is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004   #7
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
avangusva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 20
Posts: 313
How about an exhast porting?
avangusva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2004   #8
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by badazztoyz.com
good work
Thanks Bad. It came out so well it looks stock, except the bore is really shiny. If you look a photo three, you can see where the carb is mounted on a piece of 1/2 aluminum rod. I just mounted it in the drill press and spun it at low speed for the sanding and polishing.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2004   #9
PBP RACER
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 71
i wish i have a drill press...i was wondering how'd you polish it so smooth and shiny and evenly like that by using your fingers? plus, the way the polishing swirl marks go, it surely doesn't look like you polished it by hand because there's no swirl marks going in and out of the port..it's just circular around the port.

are there any tricks if the average person don't have a press to drill it evenly, or will the grinding cone automatically align itself and grind in evenly? also any ways to polish evenly with dremel or by hand? any tips appreciated...
v6pwr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2004   #10
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by v6pwr
i wish i have a drill press...i was wondering how'd you polish it so smooth and shiny and evenly like that by using your fingers? plus, the way the polishing swirl marks go, it surely doesn't look like you polished it by hand because there's no swirl marks going in and out of the port..it's just circular around the port.

are there any tricks if the average person don't have a press to drill it evenly, or will the grinding cone automatically align itself and grind in evenly? also any ways to polish evenly with dremel or by hand? any tips appreciated...
You can get a small drill press for $50 at a tool show. Pretty cheap.

I mounted the carb on a rod to sand and polish it. Look at photo three. I just chucked it into the drill press and spun it about 150 rpm. Sanding and polishing took about 15 minutes. Too easy.

The grinding point will center itself as long as you keep it straight. It could be done with a regular drill. Be aware that you have to remove a lot of metal, it will take 30-45 minutes. You won't have to remove much material when you sand and polish, so a dremel would work fine. I wouldn't try to do the grinding with a dremel, but it's been done before.

Make sure you keep the point and the carb oiled while you grind. The oil carries away the aluminum and keeps the grinder in good shape. Make sure you don't grind into the slide area or into the lip the choke sits on.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2004   #11
PBP RACER
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 71
Cool

thanks eater..that was very informative and helpful! i was just going to ask how far in you went...and you answered it. i think i'm going to port the back just a bit also and widen the black plastic port to match the back...should give it more of a venturi action. the problem with the drill press is space, even the mini one...i'm a student living in a small studio and really have no place to put it if i get one...the bike is already taking up space in front of the tv!hahahaha. this should be place in the how-to section sooner or later and not let get lost in the back pages in here...it's good info! once again, great photos and info...
v6pwr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2004   #12
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
You are welcome V6. Glad you could use the info.

I messed with the tuning of my bike yesterday. Could not get it to run well with the tt needle. Ran rich in position two, wouldn't start in position one. I reinstalled my stock home-tapered needle in position two and it runs very good. Performance is stronger from mid to high. Low end didn't change much, but I didn't expect it too. I am still lean on the jet, so I haven't done any top speed tests. Please note: Yes I am talking about using the LEAN end of the needle adjustments. The venturi creates a vacuum that really sucks the fuel out, I went from position three on the tt needle to position two on the stock needle with the intake porting only.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-2004   #13
Member
 
M J D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 39
Posts: 49
Thanks eaterofdog for the info,i have just completed mine while i was doing it i also bored it out with a 9/16 drill .what a difference it has made i am running the 5th setting on the needle with an adjustable main jet minus the adjuster part ,it really screams top end the only thing is the reads cant cope with the considerable amount of air and fuel this thing lets in .Thanks once again

Martin
M J D is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-2004   #14
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by M J D
Thanks eaterofdog for the info,i have just completed mine while i was doing it i also bored it out with a 9/16 drill .what a difference it has made i am running the 5th setting on the needle with an adjustable main jet minus the adjuster part ,it really screams top end the only thing is the reads cant cope with the considerable amount of air and fuel this thing lets in .Thanks once again

Martin
You are welcome. I had the same issue with a restrictive reed cage. I have a recent post here somewhere of the porting and dual reed install. The reeds are easy compared to the carb. I usually take photos when I mod, I figure I'll either have what to do or what NOT to do.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-2004   #15
Member
 
M J D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 39
Posts: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by eaterofdog
You are welcome. I had the same issue with a restrictive reed cage. I have a recent post here somewhere of the porting and dual reed install. The reeds are easy compared to the carb. I usually take photos when I mod, I figure I'll either have what to do or what NOT to do.
excelent i will see if i can find your write up on the dual stage reeds .
cheers Martin
M J D is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005   #16
A.K.A. Doctor Dellorto
 
bike mad yank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,384
You can get these wicked tools called uni-bits, which are like a cone shaped drill bit. Probably get them at Home Depot or Lowes. They are about 8mm (5/16") on the small end and taper up to about 22mm (7/8"). They have straight flutes so they don't grab like a drill bit and snatch it out of your hand. I'd recommend no more than 250 rpm though, as they cut quite aggressively. Job done in less than half a minute! and the surface finish they leave needs very little if any smoothing down. Start up a production line!
bike mad yank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2005   #17
Banned
 
fastcag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 58
unibit

yeah its a cool bit but the uni bit costs $33 http://www.lowes.com/lkn?action=prod...92-281-10234SM
Attached Images
File Type: jpg ini.jpg (2.2 KB, 43 views)

Last edited by fastcag : 01-08-2005 at 07:14 PM.
fastcag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2005   #18
Junior Member
 
johnhoseopipe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Age: 37
Posts: 4
The mod you have done is all good but it still doesn't change the min bore dimension as this cannot be bigger than the slide and the slide is only just bigger than the bore so does this really work at the end of the day or do you just think it does.

I would spend time on the exh port instead do not widen the port as it is to wide as it is the transfer port as also out a bit but these are not so bad do the exh mod and the bike will rev far better.


Have any of you ever looked at the port timing of one of these, there way out on the exh port. The port timing on the exh was starting to open at around 100deg ATDC where it should be between 87 - 90 (i'm not going to tell you what the best port opening time is, thats for you to find out yourself but start higher and work your way down) Remember if you grind it to high you cannot put it back on and you could have a bike that is to peaky and hard to ride and also to flat on the bottom end but if you grind it so somewhere between 90 and 92 you willo be fine.

It also has a Q port which is a slot extending from the roof of the exh port up by around 10mm to allow the exh gasses to escape earlier and reduce the noise (remember this is a chain saw engine) this port should be blocked off.(JBweld)

Transfer ports where ok as they where at 118 deg ATDC you could change this to 117 if you like the roof angle was fine as well

I then ground in a boost port, to come in 2 deg after the transfer ports (boost port opp exh port) at 60 a deg angle going up to the plug.(you dont have to do this if you dont want to)

I then ground the crank and crank cases, inlet manifold, reed cage, reed stops, carb was ok as it could not be bored anymore. The main jet was changed to suit mods.

When doing the exh mods i found that there was a large lip in the exhaust it was around 2mm all the way round ( it's where the front flange joins the tube)Therefore you could grind this out and increase the exhaust flow? Think about it instead of it being 20mm you can increase it to 24mm it doesn't sound alot but do the calc's
3.142 x 10^2 = 314.15mm^2
3.142 x 12^2 = 452.39mm^2

= 138.24mm^2 bigger in area

= 44% bigger in area

sounds a lot more now doesn't it

worth the check ?

Before and after pics
http://www.glowfoto.com/images/2004/...924417525T.jpghttp://www.glowfoto.com/images/2004/...926564389T.jpg

And when you change the clutch springs for the stiffer ones you want to bend these as well to get the most out of this mod heat the end up and rebend it so it ends up 3mm lower in overall length.
johnhoseopipe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2005   #19
PBP SENIOR MEMBER
 
eaterofdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 348
There seems to be some confusion regarding this mod that I wanted to address. My goal with this modification to the carb was to create a venturi effect. A venturi will increase the velocity of the incoming air as it travels down the throat and increased velocity means more flow through the same area. Venturis are a common feature on high performance carbs.
eaterofdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2005   #20
A.K.A. Doctor Dellorto
 
bike mad yank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,384
uni-bit

Quote:
Originally Posted by fastcag
yeah its a cool bit but the uni bit costs $33 http://www.lowes.com/lkn?action=prod...92-281-10234SM
sorry, but that is the wrong type. the bit i was refering to has straight sides not stepped. they're for thin sheet metal.
bike mad yank is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Pocketbike Forums Replies Last Post
How-To Carb Intake Porting eaterofdog Air Cooled Pocketbike How-To's 6 12-22-2009 02:25 PM
REVIEW: Billet 4 Petal Reed Setup and billet intake manifold from DDM... jman47cc Air Cooled Pocketbikes 9 08-31-2005 09:56 PM
How to: Hp Carb Tuning. Thanks to someone bmarley5780 2-Stroke Midbike How 2's 31 07-30-2005 10:49 PM
Badazztoys C1 17mm carb review BungeeGuy Water Cooled Pocketbikes 38 06-29-2005 11:09 PM
4spd Manual pipe, intake, porting...power wheelies and speeds over 60 mph genesisautoworks 4Stroke Midbikes 14 02-28-2005 10:08 PM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.1.0

Copyright © 2006 - 2008 Pocket Bike Forums | About Pocket Bike Forums | Advertising Opportunities | Legal | A member of the Crowdgather Forum Community

Style design by Leo

Page generated in 0.36334 seconds with 77 queries