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post #21 of 1857 (permalink) Old 04-14-2007 Thread Starter
 
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Re: MX650 mods?

yah i went to the store yesterday and i read the specification son the box to the mx500 an dit said 650W motor.



hmmm.


so if i keep the same stock gear ratio and 48v will that be okay or od i have to cahnge it?
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post #22 of 1857 (permalink) Old 04-14-2007 Thread Starter
 
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Re: MX650 mods?

^^^^

ooops i mean mx650
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Re: MX650 mods?

Quote:
Originally Posted by filitup View Post
yah i went to the store yesterday and i read the specification son the box to the mx500 an dit said 650W motor.

hmmm.

so if i keep the same stock gear ratio and 48v will that be okay or od i have to cahnge it?
Filitup,

Yes, I think you will be ok with the stock ratio… The bike should go 17mph stock, and ~24mph @48v. It will be up to you to take care of, and monitor your motor…
*For example, if you are riding in an area where you can only go 10-15mph, and you are always pegging the throttle, then the motor will get hot, because it cannot spin up to full speed, but you are sending a full 48v and 50-100amp surges to it… *If you take it easy in these situations, you’ll be ok. Now, when you are on a flat hard surface – you should be fine letting it all hang out. But, it is always a good idea to stop now and then, and check/touch you motor, to see if it’s getting hot – and let it cool if necessary.. If, later on, you want to “higher” the ratio, you will see a snapper bike and less heat to the motor..
I would suggest just to leave it stock at first, it’s still a great ride the way it comes! Then, when you do go 48v, you will see a significant difference that will really put a smile on you face!

-miker71
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Re: MX650 mods?

go to towerhobbies.com

look at the "MIP" temp reader, it has a wire you can rap around the motor can... cost is about $20, worth every penny cause you will no longer have to stop the bike and feal the motor with your hand, just look down at the meter.

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXGZK7&P=0
Attached Images
File Type: jpg mipg2090.jpg (11.8 KB, 68 views)

Last edited by timetime; 04-15-2007 at 01:28 AM.
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Re: MX650 mods?

Quote:
Originally Posted by miker71 View Post
Filitup,
Quote:
Originally Posted by miker71 View Post
The best thing for dirt & jumps, will be a higher ratio. A higher ratio will give more torque and make less heat on the motor. Stock, the MX bikes come with 80t rear / 11t front = 7.27:1 ratio. You should be able to go 17mph as soon as you buy it.. When you upgrade to 48v, the motor will spin faster, so you will probably end up seeing ~24mph..
Sprockets / ratios: There are a few ways to get a higher ratio. Unfortunately, none of them are direct bolt/screw on's, because the 80t rear sprocket is the biggest direct bolt on, and the 11t front sprocket is the smallest direct bolt on.. But, I have had some success modifying smaller front sprockets, to lower the ratio. You can buy 25P(the size) 9tooth & 10tooth 1/4 in diameter front sprockets from the surpluscenter.com web site for <$2 each, then tap them to screw onto your motor shaft. *For dirt, I would go with the 9t, 80t/9t=8.9:1 ratio... This combo at 48v/650/750w motor will give results like my youtube videos, and go ~18-19mph top speed... You can also buy a pre-taped 8t front sprocket off of ebay for ~$10 that will screw right on. But this 8t sprocket is a re-reversed(tapped twice) sprocket, and therefore it is a bit loose and the threads are week. My 8t worked fine at 36v, but when we went to 48v/750w motor it stripped out the second day.
Now, the other option is to buy a Currie scooter 90t rear sprocket, ~$20, this would give you 90t/11t-8.2:1 ratio - and ~20mph top speed. *The 90t Currie rear sprocket will need the center hole enlarged to fit your hub, which will require a little bit of drilling, and patience with a jig saw..(*I'm actually getting this sprocket today, and next week I will be modifying it to fit, so I can give details as how I modified it, later).
The deal on the sprockets is this: The front ones are less expensive, but need to be screwed onto the motor shaft. The threaded shaft was not originally intended for sprockets, it is for the lock nut... I have not yet had a threaded shaft snap off, but we haven’t had that combination on long enough to see how it holds up long term... The Rear 90t Currie Sprocket seems like the best way to go for peace of mind, because after you put the time into modifying it, it will just bolt onto the hub where the original does - and should be exactly like the original 80t stock one, in terms of reliability.. *I'll be able to let everyone know how the 90t sprocket works out for us, in a week or two...
Ok, I finally got a chance to try out the new 90t Currie rear sprocket on my son's MX1200(MX500 Razor Dirt Rocket) mini bike..
The difference is amazing! The new ratio is 8.18:1(90t/11t), and the difference can be felt in acceleration and easy of popping wheelies! The thing goes like a rocket, right up to 20.6mph. Even when I ride it, I can get max speed, and I'm 175lbs(100+ more than my son)!
I've attached some pics showing the stock 80t & 90t Currie sprocket. Also detailed pics of the modified MX rear swing arm, so you MX500/MX650 owners can see what is needed to be done to the swing arm, in order to fit the 1200w motor in.
Here are links to our youtube videos showing the latest test drives on my son's MX1200:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu-BaJJdmEQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhzoZ1KBgwo

-miker71
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 80t.JPG (176.6 KB, 233 views)
File Type: jpg 90t.JPG (178.6 KB, 221 views)
File Type: jpg 90t_.JPG (164.1 KB, 159 views)
File Type: jpg 90tcurrie_2.JPG (166.9 KB, 136 views)
File Type: jpg 90tcurrie_3.JPG (173.3 KB, 143 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN1372.JPG (167.7 KB, 208 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN1373.JPG (166.5 KB, 198 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN1374.JPG (170.1 KB, 163 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN1375.JPG (169.8 KB, 180 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN1377.JPG (170.8 KB, 188 views)
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Re: MX650 mods?

Quote:
Originally Posted by miker71 View Post
Here are links to our youtube videos showing the latest test drives on my son's MX1200:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu-BaJJdmEQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhzoZ1KBgwo

-miker71
If you have trouble connecting to these links, just go to youtube, and search for "mkroberge", and my videos will come up.
-miker71
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Re: MX650 mods?

miker71 - Thanks a lot for sharing all this info, it is really appreciated. aproldan popinted me to this site and the information here has been great. I plan on doing some of these mods to my MX500 (and eventually my wife's bike) in the near future, I'll let you know how it all works out.
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Re: MX650 mods?

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Originally Posted by TiddlerRacer View Post
miker71 - Thanks a lot for sharing all this info, it is really appreciated. aproldan popinted me to this site and the information here has been great. I plan on doing some of these mods to my MX500 (and eventually my wife's bike) in the near future, I'll let you know how it all works out.

TiddlerRacer,

Glad you are finding this MX Dirt Rocket upgrade info helpful! We look forward to hearing about / seeing your modified MX500, once done. If you need any help along the way, let aproldan or myself know, we’d be glad to help!
My son absolutely loves his MX1200. He’s always buzzing around like it’s on fire! The other day, I took him to a place where there were 3 foot dirt piles, and he was getting 5 feet of air, and landing his MX perfectly!! He was upset at Dad for not having the camera to video it for PB & Youtube, LOL!! We’ll catch a video of that next time…

- miker71
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Re: MX650 mods?

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Originally Posted by miker71 View Post
Filitup,
I don't know about the 650w motor specs, but I bet it's pretty close to the 750w. My Son's bike went like ~24mph with the stock MX dirt Rocket gears setup(80tooth rear/11tooth front = 7.27:1 ratio)
*Because you are now going to buy the MX650(650w motor), this would be a good candidate to first just try the 48v upgrade(without trying the 750w motor at first). It's only advertised at 100w less than the 750w motor... If you go onto the unite motor web site, they don't even list this motor? I am personally wondering if the MX650 may really just have the 750w motor in it.
Filitup, this might be worth holding off on the 750w motor, to see if you get the same performance at aproldan and I did, before you spend the extra ~$65 on a new motor, that you may already be getting with the mx650...
If you just go without the motor for now:
~$20 Extra 12v/12ah battery.
~$40 100a/48v controller
~$38 48v battery charger
~$45 for incedentals, and shipping..
~$140 - ~$150 total for your initial upgrade..
i am getting the mx650 and want to upgrade it and are new to dirt bikes
and is clueless about controllers, battery's, and teeth can you help me?
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Re: MX650 mods?

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Originally Posted by bmj2468 View Post
i am getting the mx650 and want to upgrade it and are new to dirt bikes
and is clueless about controllers, battery's, and teeth can you help me?
bmj2468,

Ok, the first think you should do, is read through this entire forum. It discusses a wide range of options, of modding stock MX500/650's. (*you may be able to answer most any question you have, after reading these posts.. )

*From you prior messages to me on youtube, and you are now going to buy a MX650, I'm guessing you may first want to try the basic upgrade? Good, this is always the way to start!
I'm guessing you will start by staying with the stock 650w motor, and try upgrading to 48v(from 36v stock) and a new more powerful power controller.
I suggest buying parts from TNC Scooters:
~$20 Extra 12v/12ah battery.
~$45 100a/48v controller
~$38 48v battery charger
~$40 for incidentals, and shipping (incidentals like 12 gauge wire, an Automotive fuse-able link, New On/Off switch, ect...
~$140 total for your initial upgrade..
*I would suggest leaving the gears stock at first. The 11tooth front/80tooth rear stock gears are rock solid, and with this initial upgrade, you should be able to go from stock speed of ~17mph to ~24mph.
*Like I mentioned in prior notes, you will need to watch the temperature of your motor, and you should be ok. *If you are riding mainly on flat hard surfaces, you should have nothing to worry about, but if you are doing hills, grass, and dirt - then check the motor often - and take breaks as necessary, to let the motor cool.

-miker71
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Re: MX650 mods?

even a 13t front sprocket is enough to make the stock mx500 motor hot. especially on hills.
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Re: MX650 mods?

Quote:
Originally Posted by miker71 View Post
bmj2468,

Ok, the first think you should do, is read through this entire forum. It discusses a wide range of options, of modding stock MX500/650's. (*you may be able to answer most any question you have, after reading these posts.. )

*From you prior messages to me on youtube, and you are now going to buy a MX650, I'm guessing you may first want to try the basic upgrade? Good, this is always the way to start!
I'm guessing you will start by staying with the stock 650w motor, and try upgrading to 48v(from 36v stock) and a new more powerful power controller.
I suggest buying parts from TNC Scooters:
~$20 Extra 12v/12ah battery.
~$45 100a/48v controller
~$38 48v battery charger
~$40 for incidentals, and shipping (incidentals like 12 gauge wire, an Automotive fuse-able link, New On/Off switch, ect...
~$140 total for your initial upgrade..
*I would suggest leaving the gears stock at first. The 11tooth front/80tooth rear stock gears are rock solid, and with this initial upgrade, you should be able to go from stock speed of ~17mph to ~24mph.
*Like I mentioned in prior notes, you will need to watch the temperature of your motor, and you should be ok. *If you are riding mainly on flat hard surfaces, you should have nothing to worry about, but if you are doing hills, grass, and dirt - then check the motor often - and take breaks as necessary, to let the motor cool.

-miker71
OK THAKSFOR YOUR REPLY
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Re: MX650 mods?

hi,

I also have a mx650. I am attempting the 48volt hop up based off of this forum and need your knowledge of where you put the 4 battery. Any suggestions would be great.
Also, I need 12 gauge wire, and an automotive what?
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Re: MX650 mods?

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Originally Posted by tera View Post
hi,

I also have a mx650. I am attempting the 48volt hop up based off of this forum and need your knowledge of where you put the 4 battery. Any suggestions would be great.
Also, I need 12 gauge wire, and an automotive what?
Tera,
When I had an extra 12v battery, I mounted it on the upper battery tray. I bent all 4 battery tray tabs down, turned the batteries 90 degrees, and mounted them side-ways. Check out my How to 2 12v batts.jpg.
-miker71

Also, I have had quite a few people also ask me how I mounted my controller, ran wiring, mounted my battery charger port, 50amp on/off toggle switch, how I got the MX500 plastic fake engine case to fit back on, ect... Also, A few people have inquired how I mounted my $8 Wal-Mart bicycle speedometer.. So, I am posting .jpg photo's that should answer all of these questions. Hope this helps
-miker71
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1 Controller wireing fuses.JPG (128.6 KB, 498 views)
File Type: jpg 2 How to 2 12v Batts, Controller wireing.JPG (136.5 KB, 535 views)
File Type: jpg 3 Charger port and on off toggle.JPG (184.4 KB, 335 views)
File Type: jpg 4 Modified case to fit new parts.JPG (182.9 KB, 354 views)
File Type: jpg 5 Completed 1.JPG (133.5 KB, 321 views)
File Type: jpg 6 Completed 2.JPG (173.5 KB, 252 views)
File Type: jpg 7 Completed 3.JPG (175.6 KB, 233 views)
File Type: jpg 8 Speedo 1.JPG (178.1 KB, 264 views)
File Type: jpg 9 Speedo 2 and charger port and on off toggle.JPG (165.5 KB, 253 views)
File Type: jpg 10 Speedo 3.JPG (170.5 KB, 238 views)
File Type: jpg 11 Speedo 4.JPG (171.2 KB, 270 views)
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Re: MX650 mods?

I flattened the batterybox sides, turned the bat 90 degrees, added the 2nd bat, but they do not fit. In the pics you posted, it doesn't show 2 bats on top. How did you do it? Cut the battery box frame? My batteries together need 7 3/4", which exceeds this. Also, why did you add a different on/off switch?
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Re: MX650 mods?

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Originally Posted by tera View Post
I flattened the batterybox sides, turned the bat 90 degrees, added the 2nd bat, but they do not fit. In the pics you posted, it doesn't show 2 bats on top. How did you do it? Cut the battery box frame? My batteries together need 7 3/4", which exceeds this. Also, why did you add a different on/off switch?
Tera,
My Bad.. I forgot one step with using two batteries in the upper batt tray. After you have turned the batts 90degrees, you then also have to turn them on their sides. (*See photos*). Once they are on their sides, they just barley fit - good enough to tie-wrap down. (It's ok to turn these batts this way, because they are sealed batts.).
I had these batts in my son's bike this way for one season - and they worked fine. *Currently, I have a different battery combination than most of you. I have one 36v block batt in the lower tray(got this on close-out), and one 12v batt in the upper tray - for 48v total. But, I had the combination I described (*two batts in upper tray - two batts in lower tray, before, and it works fine) - without cutting any frame away.

I added a different on/off switch(50amp, bought at automotive store) because the stock Razor on/off switch is rated at 30amps, and if you upgraded to the 100a/48v controller, you may melt the stock flimsy switch, or start to have contact problems. The rugged 50a switch I use works fine, and never gets hot. Also, I did some current measurements with this combination, and what I saw was: When you PEG the throttle, the motor gets a spike of 40-50amps, then as the motor spins up, the amps decrease to 5-10 amps continuous

I relocated both the Battery charger port and on/off switch up to the fake gas tank, so when I need to take the fake black engine covers off, they don’t have wires attached to them – and now you have easy have access to everything..

Hope this helps,
-miker71
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Batte oriented so they fit.JPG (182.7 KB, 322 views)
File Type: jpg Batts oriented incorrectly.JPG (168.2 KB, 272 views)
File Type: jpg two batts.jpg (50.7 KB, 315 views)

Last edited by miker71; 07-29-2007 at 08:43 AM.
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Re: MX650 mods?

I would of never figured that out. Thank you for helping me. I really apperciate your time & knowledge.

I now have the batteries mounted and the controller mounted in the same spot as you.

I am having difficulties understanding how to correctly wire my YK42-4 controller. The diagram that came with it doesn't show how to wire in the brake wires, charger receptacle, on/off switch, fuasble link.
Think you could explain how to do this?
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Re: MX650 mods?

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Originally Posted by tera View Post
I would of never figured that out. Thank you for helping me. I really apperciate your time & knowledge.

I now have the batteries mounted and the controller mounted in the same spot as you.

I am having difficulties understanding how to correctly wire my YK42-4 controller. The diagram that came with it doesn't show how to wire in the brake wires, charger receptacle, on/off switch, fuasble link.
Think you could explain how to do this?
Tera,
Sorry for taking so long to get back with you, - been busy!
The YK42-4 controller is a basic controller. There are no brake or battery charger port connections (you don't really need them anyway, if you can be careful. (*They are safety features).
Brakes: These 2 wire connections went to your stock mx500 controller so that if you press the brake, the motor will cut out. *I just cut my brake wires at the brake handle. *Now, my son can hold the front brake, and goose the throttle to do burn outs! (*not recommended on a regular basis, but fun once and awhile, if the pavement is wet). (*Oh yeah, I swapped the front brake handle to the left handle bar!)
Battery charger: Just connect this across your final configuration of 48v of batteries in series. Connect them right off of your batt terminals. Don't connect either wire on the other side of your on/off switch! *You want it so when your bike is switched off, you can plug your charger in, and it will directly charge the batteries, not the controller. *Also, put a 5a fuse inline with the positive lead of the battery charger port.
ON/OFF Switch & Fusible Link: Take the positive lead off of your 48v's of batteries - run it to the fusible link - then from the fusible link to the on/off switch. Then, run the wire from the other side of the on/off switch to your controller.
-miker71
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Re: MX650 mods?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesseforlife
Hi miker, my name is jesse and i just got a mx 500 1 month ago. My town has great streets with so many of them i hope to discover with my mx 500. However, i've always thought that my mx 500 could give me more speed than what it gave me at first. So i found this site luckely for me i found this site. I have an unlimited budjet to spend on my mx 500. I want to get the most speed out of my mx 500. I do not use my mx for offroad purposes, only for speeeed!!!! I do not want to make any welding to my bike, however i am willing to spend on the motor, controler and ext... I was just wondering if you would be kind enough to answer my email as i have seen how busy u are through this site lol! I have visited the tncscooter.com website, but i would greatly appreciate if you would make me a complete list of the things i need to get tthe most speed out of my mx 500. also i have a question would this 900 watt motor fit in my mx 500 without welding link: http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAND-NEW-900-WA...QQcmdZViewItem
Jesse,
The part#'s from Chris at TNC that I bought to first upgrade my son's MX500 to a MX750 48v are:
~$20 Extra 12v/12ah battery #101160
~$45 100a/48v controller #101215
~$38 48v battery charger #101158
~$65 750w/36v motor #106150


For Speed, see answers to sprocket change questions:
https://www.pocketbikeplanet.com/118-...00-please.html

As far as that question about that 900w motor. I'm not familiar with that one. It appears to be of correct size, but not sure of the mounting holes?
I know the 750w motor from TNC fit's right in, with no cutting or welding.

-miker71
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Re: MX650 mods?

Quote:
Originally Posted by trueawoodstar1
hey, could you send me how to connect the extra battery to make a 48 volt and is there any thing else i would need to buy other than a 100 amp controller?
trueawoodstar1,
The extra 12v battery goes in series with the other 3 12v batts the mx500 came with.
As far as what you will need, or how/where to hook stuff up, read the mx650 forum.
-miker71
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