New Bike water pump problems - Pocket Bike Forum - Mini Bikes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
New Bike water pump problems

Hey all - (@EPR @ CAM2) I need some help with this bike I just picked up pretty cheap it's a Blata Elite 10/11 with WC Polini engine. I got it home and started it and took the fairings off to look at the water pump and this pinion drive pulley just fell off! Looks like it was jb welded on! Anyway every clutch bell available on the internet shows the drive pulley between the case and sprocket. This bike had the drive pulley on the end of the pinion to line up with the lower pulley. Can anyone direct me to where I can buy the correct set up or did I get had more than I think on this deal thanks
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20190323_124922148_1553377987107.jpg (409.8 KB, 8 views)
russpalmbones is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
Photo of bike
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20190323_124934815_1553378155101.jpg (517.2 KB, 7 views)
russpalmbones is offline  
post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
Cylinder on bike
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20190323_124930683_1553378207245.jpg (352.3 KB, 6 views)
russpalmbones is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,511
Re: New Bike water pump problems

You have the wrong clutch housing because the old owner changed up on the engine....

This is the clutchbell with pinion pulley you need....


143.075.006 - Clutch housing complete kit includes clutch drum, bearing, water pump pulley & 6T pinion-standard 80mm/pinion driven water pump models

If you go with this clutch housing you will need to flip the waterpump and remount it 180* backwards and make some spacers to space the bracket off the clutchbell housing...…..

If the whole shebang is too much try getting a pinion pulley and modifying the housing with a grinder...…..143.115.003 - Water pump pulley on pinion / pinion driven water pump models


With that cob jobbery of a waterpump pulley Id say that engine is on borrowed time which would be from possible overheating....The guy should of atleast drilled in a rollpin n slotted the hole and drilled n tapped the pinion end for a screw with washer,

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 4 Weeks Ago at 08:16 AM.
CAM2 is offline  
post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
Thanks CAM2 Lesson learned just because I could see the belt turning doesn't mean it's all good next time I'm removing the fairings and looking a little better!
russpalmbones is offline  
post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,511
Re: New Bike water pump problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by russpalmbones View Post
Thanks CAM2 Lesson learned just because I could see the belt turning doesn't mean it's all good next time I'm removing the fairings and looking a little better!
Yes exactly..My advice to everybody buying a pocketbike is if you simply cant start the thing up then take it for a test ride its basically a parts only sale.If it runs and rides look it over carefully.

Had that snafu been caught in time it couldve been used as leverage to get the price cut in half..

Your current cylinder is a 40cc 3 port and you have a 6.2 crankcase..….

In any event youll be well versed in Polini when done and great practice knowing what the euro stuff is all about...........


Good Luck

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 4 Weeks Ago at 11:48 AM.
CAM2 is offline  
post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
Re: New Bike water pump problems

You can buy just the Polini pulley if you can find one and then JB Weld the pulley to the pinion gear. When you want to remove it, heat the pinion. Will cost $200 plus to buy a new clutch housing and then, will it line up with the water pump pulley?? On my clone 39cc Polini engine running a Polini clutch housing and Euro clutch, had to make my own bracket too. Remember that pulley is going to turn at 12,000 RPMs, so it has to be round not oblong, lol. See photo, that is not a drive belt, it a tank track off one of my kids toys. I put it there for the photo, lol.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg China Polini Eng.jpg (511.6 KB, 5 views)

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
PBP RACER
 
Chrisi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Age: 36
Posts: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by EPR View Post
You can buy just the Polini pulley if you can find one and then JB Weld the pulley to the pinion gear. When you want to remove it, heat the pinion. Will cost $200 plus to buy a new clutch housing and then, will it line up with the water pump pulley?? On my clone 39cc Polini engine running a Polini clutch housing and Euro clutch, had to make my own bracket too. Remember that pulley is going to turn at 12,000 RPMs, so it has to be round not oblong, lol. See photo, that is not a drive belt, it a tank track off one of my kids toys. I put it there for the photo, lol.
I don't know where you buy your material, 200$ for a clutchhousing 🤔🤔.

A new pully 10-15€
A new clutchbell( don't need a new clutchhousing) 50€
The mounting material can be made be him self.

The big rpm is not the problem only must mount a biger pully on the waterpump.

Here i mount it on a blata/bzm engine.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 15534547321162075385709_1553454753941.jpg (480.4 KB, 7 views)

Get your kick with 2 stroke mix

Last edited by Chrisi; 4 Weeks Ago at 02:13 PM.
Chrisi is online now  
post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
Re: New Bike water pump problems

A new Polini pulley housing is $185 plus tax, $15 = $200, then $175 for a Euro clutch plus other materials, $400 total. Just make what you have work, and save your money. I don't buy from Europe anymore, especially Germany. On my billet racing cases from Germany, first had paid to change my money, then had to pay customs and taxes and then a 19% VAT tax to get it out of the country and then unreal shipping cost. I paid $6.35 to send a 4 oz. piston to England. Here is a hint make your bracket & water pump pulley line up with the housing pulley. If you can't fit your pulley to the outside buy a Polini pulley like I did and mount it behind the pinion. then mount your pump to line up with that pulley. You might have to cut pathways on the housing like the housing CAM2 showed.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....

Last edited by EPR; 4 Weeks Ago at 08:22 PM.
EPR is offline  
post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
PBP RACER
 
Chrisi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Age: 36
Posts: 104
@EPR I know the problem only if you buy from a private person. If you buy at an official shop you can issue a tax-free invoice, because you have to pay the tax when importing to the US.

@ Russpalm bone, you need only the pulley and a matching clutch bell. You can do the ways for the belt yourself.

Get your kick with 2 stroke mix
Chrisi is online now  
post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
Thanks guys problem solved - the seller called me and delivered a new pulley to me. I will buy a new bell cover online for $92 euro with pulley from Pedparts.com in the UK and Fab a bracket for back up. In the meantime Pedparts is sourcing the threaded pinion/pulley for me . See photos, Thanks for the help.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20190325_083426939_1553528629800.jpg (215.9 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20190325_083453932_1553528648209.jpg (216.1 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg Screenshot_20190325-084451_1553528748920.jpg (45.4 KB, 7 views)
russpalmbones is offline  
post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
BTW @EPR my son and I have been getting track time at the Stockton track and are riding/racing some guys at the Kart track in Dixon on the 30th. $40 for all day. You should load your truck up and come ride with us.
russpalmbones is offline  
post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 4 Weeks Ago
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,511
Re: New Bike water pump problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by russpalmbones View Post
Thanks guys problem solved - the seller called me and delivered a new pulley to me. I will buy a new bell cover online for $92 euro with pulley from Pedparts.com in the UK and Fab a bracket for back up. In the meantime Pedparts is sourcing the threaded pinion/pulley for me . See photos, Thanks for the help.


Very nice of the seller to be of assistance after the sale...Its rare......

It looks like alls youll need to do is install the pinion and the pulley with that setup and don't need the housing with grooves or modifying brackets or flipping the waterpump anymore..........

IDK if its the camera or the chain but it appears its time for a change...The eurobike manufacturers use a Premier series #25 chain....

Theres a chain treatment I do to brand new chains before installing them I posted the process on a few threads...

Link to the process.. https://www.pocketbikeplanet.com/899889-post104.html

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 3 Weeks Ago at 12:11 PM.
CAM2 is offline  
post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 3 Weeks Ago
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,511
Re: New Bike water pump problems

To remove the pinion I use a Gator socket tool on a 18v cordless impact gun with 3/8" adapter..

It removes them quick n easy...……..




Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 3 Weeks Ago at 12:07 PM.
CAM2 is offline  
post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 3 Weeks Ago
Re: New Bike water pump problems

That's $92.50 GBP, ( pounds ), $125 USD ??, how much is shipping?? You don't need a new bell or housing the way you are running the pulley on the outside of the pinion. I am lost, did the seller thread the end of the pinion and send you a threaded pulley?? Cant make the 30th, all my stuff is still stored for winter.
Great job on the fix.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #16 of 23 (permalink) Old 2 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
Update got the water pump figured out. The bike came with 9/78 gearing so I switched it up to 6/68 and took it out to the track for the first ride. Unbelievable how much smoother it rides compared to my Cags and when it hits the power band it wants to come out from underneath me. I'm really going to enjoy this bike.
russpalmbones is offline  
post #17 of 23 (permalink) Old 2 Weeks Ago
Re: New Bike water pump problems

Way to go dude. on the water pump. You went from 8.66:1 to 11.3:1 you might try 7/68 or 7/66, 9.7:1 or 9.4:1. The 11.3 gives better take off but the front t ire likes to ride the air, lol.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #18 of 23 (permalink) Old 2 Weeks Ago Thread Starter
PBP RACER
 
russpalmbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 50
Garage
@EPR I just got a 7tooth pinion that fits the Polini bell and have to cut the threads for the pulley and will run with 7/68 that's what all my Cags run best with. I'm trying to figure out how old this bike is I think it's a Blata Elite 11w - do you know what years they we're produced? Serial is CZ 07648 WE
russpalmbones is offline  
post #19 of 23 (permalink) Old 2 Weeks Ago
Re: New Bike water pump problems

Most Blata's come with either an air cooled or W/C Blata engine. The bike is made in the Czech Rep. in Europe. The Polini engine is made in Italy?? I think the factory made some W/C Polini engine bikes. It could be 10 years old. I have both clone Blata bikes, but the 39cc A/C engine is in a clone C1 W/C frame. The engine mounts are a little different on the Polini and Blata engines
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Blue Air Cooled Blata1.jpg (461.3 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg Blue Air Cooled Blata2.jpg (411.9 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg C1 Eng water cooled.jpg (494.5 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg 40cc Air Cooled C1 Blata Clone2.jpg (477.4 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg C1 water cooled2.jpg (491.4 KB, 5 views)

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #20 of 23 (permalink) Old 2 Weeks Ago
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,511
Re: New Bike water pump problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPR View Post
Most Blata's come with either an air cooled or W/C Blata engine. The bike is made in the Czech Rep. in Europe. The Polini engine is made in Italy?? I think the factory made some W/C Polini engine bikes. It could be 10 years old. I have both clone Blata bikes, but the 39cc A/C engine is in a clone C1 W/C frame. The engine mounts are a little different on the Polini and Blata engines
They put the AMG engines in Mercedes Zonda and Pagani...….They put ZF german made transmissions in Ford pickups and put Mitsubishi engines in Chryslers….LOL..Ford and Chevy once teamed up and developed the 8/9 and 10 speed transmission together..

The engine they put in the Blata 2.5/ 2.6 and the Blata quadard is manufactured by a company called Robin just to show you Blata didn't manufacture their own engines til the money from the earlier models of the elite 11 paved the way to developing the Blata based engine.....



Im sure it will all come back to you after you read this thread from a few years back.You participated in it.LOL

https://www.pocketbikeplanet.com/172...ne-help-2.html

Also heres a lil history on the Elite 11...Its deemed the most sought after race bike til 2001..You can skip all the fluff and scroll down to the Bold lettered paragraph..

Blata - výroba a prodej motocykl?, minibik?, ?ty?kolek a skútr?

https://www.dirtbikefix.com/Blata-mini-motos.html

Pavel Blata started his involvement with pocketbikes when Vittorino Orazi's company enlisted the help of the Czechoslovakian-born Blata in the early 1990s to help first with the production of parts, and then complete bikes for the Vittorazi minimoto company.

After a successful run at constructing bikes and parts for Vittorazi, Blata soon decided to move on from simply manufacturing, to selling his own line of Bikes. Blata then changed and refined his bike's design, and began producing his pocketbikes under his own brand name in his native Czechoslovakia. Blata production now included the mini 2.5, and Blatino scooter models.


Pavel Blata then met Rastislav Brodsky at the 1992 MotoVelo Fair in Prague. Ras was at the time working for the Czech industrial agro-computer company, PVD, which had refocused its business model after the revolution, and had been building their own small motorized scooter called the "Zoom" since 1990.

The scooter was designed by PVD with styling design help from a professor, and dean of design at the University of Zlin, Czechoslovakia, a division of the Technical University of Prague, and another well respected Czech technical designer, and was being manufactured for PVD by the Czech aircraft company, Moravan.


Ras Brodsky soon left PVD and joined forces with Pavel Blata in 1992, and by 1993 Blata had already designed and were racing the new Polini powered Elite 11 model, which they would add to the lineup in 1994.

Rasto still works for Blata to tis day...I think hes in Florida now....

I sent the frame number over to him to get RussPB the whole shebang on his model like year manufactured aswell as a manual pdf...…..

When I get the goods I'll definitely share...……..

One things for sure is Russ definitely has one of the earlier models so depending on what he paid for it I'd say he can be rest assured he has a 100% legitimate racer that's built the way it should be,,..….

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 2 Weeks Ago at 05:08 PM.
CAM2 is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Pocket Bike Forum - Mini Bikes forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Pocketbike Forums Replies Last Post
Water pump pulley problems CaliRider Water Cooled Pocketbikes 2 07-02-2014 12:15 PM
BZM new water pump NaSa Water Cooled Pocketbikes 8 08-06-2007 02:24 AM
C1 water pump problems greaseygetzen Water Cooled Pocketbikes 21 01-06-2007 08:58 AM
Will a BZM water pump fit the banshee pump bracket? skiddmarks Water Cooled Pocketbikes 2 07-18-2006 10:35 PM
Banshee water pump O-ring for 2nd gen with pump at bottom. Ludeboye Water Cooled Pocketbikes 2 08-12-2005 12:01 AM

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome