Help identifying this crank - Pocket Bike Forum - Mini Bikes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 139 (permalink) Old 01-23-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Help identifying this crank

so I have been wondering around the house making engine sounds and throttle twisting motions now my girlfriend is starting to think im up to something well im not but I do need a little help identifying the wrist pin size on this rod so I can order a few more parts all my tools are 350 miles away and I want to try and order everything and with a bit of luck everything will somehow workout when I go and see my dad and I can get a little time in front of the mill lathe and welder
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20150123_173642[1].jpg (288.3 KB, 19 views)
MrKitty is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,829
Re: Help identifying this crank

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKitty View Post
so I have been wondering around the house making engine sounds and throttle twisting motions now my girlfriend is starting to think im up to something well im not but I do need a little help identifying the wrist pin size on this rod so I can order a few more parts all my tools are 350 miles away and I want to try and order everything and with a bit of luck everything will somehow workout when I go and see my dad and I can get a little time in front of the mill lathe and welder
12mm pin x 32mm stroke full circle crank................

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece
CAM2 is offline  
post #3 of 139 (permalink) Old 01-23-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Re: Help identifying this crank

thank you Cam2 all so thank you for all the information in your Cag thread i have read the thread front and back about 4 times now and will be using a lot of the thread for reference on my build especially the balancing that needs to be done in the flywheel for these full circle cranks
MrKitty is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Re: Help identifying this crank

They have both FC cranks in 10 and 12mm pin ID depending on what piston you use.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #5 of 139 (permalink) Old 01-28-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Re: Help identifying this crank

yea the thing is I got this crank off ebay with basically no information so im trying to order the rest of this engine around this crank so now im looking for a piston and cylinder for it and my luck is failing me I cant seam to find the parts in a non kit form all in all it looks like I might be ordering the stock parts with a 12mm pin then figuring out how to mount the cylinder in the lathe without distorting it in any way and part the cylinder from the head or just try and do the head chop with a hack saw like I read about in the forum
MrKitty is offline  
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,829
Re: Help identifying this crank

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKitty View Post
yea the thing is I got this crank off ebay with basically no information so im trying to order the rest of this engine around this crank so now im looking for a piston and cylinder for it and my luck is failing me I cant seam to find the parts in a non kit form all in all it looks like I might be ordering the stock parts with a 12mm pin then figuring out how to mount the cylinder in the lathe without distorting it in any way and part the cylinder from the head or just try and do the head chop with a hack saw like I read about in the forum
ADA 44mm 2pc cylinder 12mm pin piston w/ piston rings kit on ebay $50 bux.............no crank.......N!pples has bought one.............Its a descent kit............

then theres this kit too............ http://www.ebay.com/itm/44mm-Big-Bor...7be12b&vxp=mtr

This ones the ADA 40mm piston kit with 10mm pin but pretty much looks the same....................




Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 01-28-2015 at 08:00 PM.
CAM2 is offline  
Re: Help identifying this crank

Well, you have a 12mm crank, that kit that CAM2 posted is $56 free shipping and it has 2 upper ports and fingers on the main transfer ports. On that page look below on the page a bunch more head kits $75 for the Billet 15:1 Winged Head Kit, think it has a 12mm FC crank.
I would not get a kit with 3 upper ports and 44mm/12mm 2 triangle port piston. With the 3 ports there is little cyld left and it will wear out alot faster. See Lucky 7 custom bike photo.
I just took the 2 upper port cyld that's for my German Billet case Cag engine, and with my Dremel cut out the middle bar and made one big upper port.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Lucky 7 Semi Chopper 1.jpg (181.5 KB, 8 views)
File Type: jpg 5 Port BB Cag Engine1.jpg (155.6 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg 5 Port BB Cag Engine2.jpg (242.8 KB, 6 views)

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #8 of 139 (permalink) Old 01-30-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Re: Help identifying this crank

Right on thanks guys im going to try and pick up one of these kits after the bills are paid today hopefully a miracle happens and a bunch of people come into my computer shop with broken computers
MrKitty is offline  
But who prays for Satan?
 
NaSa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Age: 38
Posts: 6,571
Images: 41
Re: Help identifying this crank

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKitty View Post
Right on thanks guys im going to try and pick up one of these kits after the bills are paid today hopefully a miracle happens and a bunch of people come into my computer shop with broken computers
You do computer repairs MrKitty? that's what I used to do, been Microsoft certified since late '99 / 2000.

Where is your shop?

C1 / B1-rep Tear-Down and Rebuild Info /w 400+ Pictures
Set your "Squish" HowTo: /w 70 Pictures
Technical Editor @ Mitchell 1
NC3 / S-Tech Certified Technician
NaSa is offline  
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,829
Re: Help identifying this crank

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaSa View Post
You do computer repairs MrKitty? that's what I used to do, been Microsoft certified since late '99 / 2000.

Where is your shop?

I dibble-dabble with them pesky pc's myself......LOL...My brother-in law has been in the biz a long time but I don't wanna name his shop seeings hes a royal "Richard" and we aren't on speaking terms at the moment so why give the doofus a free plug?......LOL

I found out in the computer biz if you expand outwards and learn on how to fix the game systems aswell as cracked phone screens biz will pick up.....

The Galaxys5 screens are a beotch but can be done...ive done 3 for a few friends not too long ago................Saved them all about $175.00 each.........

Besides he has knowledge of computers and techniques that I have taught him when he first started out seeings one of my jobs when building wafer scanning equipment for a subcontractor for Motorola I had to build the computers that ran the operating systems from scratch....

From the automatic insertion of the ic's via an automatic insertion machine from raw board up to finished product,,building the machine physically,,,get the machines to jive with the pc's and operate the system for the machine its married to................This was around 96/97.....

Around 1998/1999 I worked for a company called Globecomm systems[a fortune 500 company at the time] who took the inventor of the internets ideas for a more vast exploration into cyberspace and turned it into a reality..I watched a dozen launches to put 13 satellites into orbit........I went to so many countries to install 5.3 meter and 10 meter antennas to link the gateways and bounce them off satellites it was ridiculous............So you might say I am one of the real reasons the more improved internet started to exist and evolve from dial-up...............LOL

Soon after leaving there I went into another privatized subcontractor position where I was building firing solution boxes for the militarys Apache helicopter,,,,,,,,,,,

After that job I went into the trenched and trenchless fiber optic installation company and installed the cables for two major cable TV suppliers for quite a few years while also rolling other avenues too in building race engines aswell as home improvement also piloting commercial dredging ships from 50ft up to 220ft......

Nick you should look into getting a TWIC license and on your off seasons venture into that....The pay is killer...so is the benefits aswell as lifes experience......

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 02-02-2015 at 07:35 PM.
CAM2 is offline  
post #11 of 139 (permalink) Old 02-10-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Re: Help identifying this crank

thats awesome and good advice thank you I do fix tabs and phones and just about anything electronic even tubed guitar amps I was building R/F liners for the 11 meter band but then I got shut down by FCC but it was fun well it lasted I have since moved to Idaho I miss my electronics lab I had set up in Seattle now days I do a lot of simple replacement of bad components everything is modular now days it makes things easy but a lot les fun.

I did get my order in for that kit you found for me I am riley impressed with the ebayer http://stores.ebay.com/permile77/ he even sent me pics of my kit right before it was shipped im excited to get it and start blue printing.

I do have a few questions still in this parts gather before buildup im not shore on the crank bearings I know I definitely don't want to go back in with the china bearings im also wondering about possible options for seals ( I know you have talked about some kind of dbl seal mod ) and well im collecting up my parts is the Honda z50R carb a good way to

thanks for your help I cant weight to start the buildup thread
Attached Images
File Type: jpg pocketbikeparts.jpg (72.6 KB, 13 views)
MrKitty is offline  
Re: Help identifying this crank

I have done business with them a few times, parts always good and low prices, insane, lol. First, you need to ditch the .025" paper base gasket, go to PB Parts in Florida, under performance parts for an MT-A2 Cag get the $1.99 .010" copper base gasket, glue it to the cases w/ a very thin layer of Yamabond, to lower and seal cyld to the cases. There is no compression there only maybe 20lb. of cases press. In both cases the piston is higher creating more compression, that's on a stock cyld.
You have a 2 piece cyld kit, by taking material off the top of the cyld/head ring for the round copper head gasket, you raise the compression. Modify the cases and cyld and exhaust port, for better flow.
What you do to determine cyld height is, put the crank in your cases, put the ringless piston on the rod, with cylinder over it. Put crank on TDC and measure from the top edge of the piston to top of cyld. .060" to .060" is not uncommon. The more of that you lose the more compression you get. My A2 Cag., the rope is so hard to pull, it picks the bike up off the ground, need someone to hold it down or sit on it. My shoulder and hands have been injured a few. It's the price to pay for more power, nothings free, lol.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #13 of 139 (permalink) Old 02-16-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Re: Help identifying this crank

thanks im going to get my order in today for that thin copper base gasket im still searching around for good crank bearings for it if anyone has a tips on a place to get some and the part numbers that would be awesome
MrKitty is offline  
Re: Help identifying this crank

Make sure you click HP parts, the reg. Cag copper is .020". You only need Yamabond if you are not using a base gasket. I spray all my gaskets, paper or copper w/ Napa Auto/Permatex Copper Spray-A Gasket, high temp sealant, on copper it improves heat transfer between the cyld-gasket-head.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
post #15 of 139 (permalink) Old 02-19-2015 Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
MrKitty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Age: 38
Posts: 1,398
Garage
Re: Help identifying this crank

good call on the copper gasket spray I use that stuff on all my gaskets on my truck and anything I happen to be working on its awesome stuff im not shore if im going to use a base gasket or not even though I ordered it everyone seams to be having good luck with just yamabond and it will give it just a little more compression without the base gasket

on a note I got my parts in today here are some pictures
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20150219_104539.jpg (493.1 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20150219_104719.jpg (374.4 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20150219_104738.jpg (254.9 KB, 12 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20150219_105915.jpg (455.9 KB, 8 views)
MrKitty is offline  
Re: Help identifying this crank

Yamabond dries real fast, it's rubbery which is why it make a good seal. You can also JB Weld the cyld to the cases with a thin layer, but have to heat the cases and cyld to get them apart later.
Best way with bond is get the piston w/ rings on the rod, put the eng. on TDC, put the cyld over the piston. Then with my finger I spread a very thin layer with my fore finger on the case area where the cyld. mates, drop it down right away, on a one piece cyld put the 4 short bolts on just lightly finger tight or a two piece cyld get 4 short M6 x 1.0 x 25mm allen bolts finger tight cause the long bolts won't work. Wait till the next day, in your case, pull the short bolts, put the head on and put it back together w/ the long bolts and torque them down and your ready to Rock & Roll, lol.

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
BUILDEM,WRECKEM,REBUILDEM
 
CAM2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 20,829
Re: Help identifying this crank

I see lots of transfer port work needed with that cylinder...............

I tried the copper spray technique too on both a copper base gasket aswell as a copper sealing ring,,,,when I disassembled the engine it was like I never sprayed a thing...

I use JB weld to bond the cylinder to the case...It prevents cylinder walk aswell as seals it very well....It only takes a lil heat with a plumbers torch to remove the cylinder and removing the dried JB is no harder than removing a compressed paper gasket...............

I come to find the copper base gaskets are die stamp formed and dont seal too well because the copper isnt as soft as it should be..............

When you assemble the cap onto the cylinder make sure you put the copper sealing ring on right to get proper compression............The "U" shape should mate with the cap dome and the rounded face facing the cylinder lip..............

Cut
Up
Stuff
To
Obtain
Masterpiece

Last edited by CAM2; 02-20-2015 at 09:34 PM.
CAM2 is offline  
PBP RACER
 
motorida's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 71
Re: Help identifying this crank

Would hi temp gasket silicon work like yamabond?
motorida is offline  
Re: Help identifying this crank

It might, but you need thin to, becareful not to use to much also. If it forms a bead inside the cases, that can break off and get in your bearings or...... same for yamabond. If the engine gets hotter than 250 degress you got problems. I have some Permatex Ultra High Temp, copper silicon, up to 750 degrees, even the reg. high temp goes to 450+

Empty Pockets Racing: The difficult we do, the impossible takes longer.....
EPR is offline  
Bicycle with Engine
 
flattie42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 881
Re: Help identifying this crank

I've been using Permatex Ultra Copper gasket maker in a tube for exhausts and it works out like a dream. I also lapped the surfaces of the exhaust port and the header so they fit tight. No leakage whatsoever. It dries super fast so be quick with it... It would be interesting seeing how it holds up on the cylinder. It says not to be used with head gaskets or anything in contact with gasoline, but technically it would be used as a 'base' gasket. Which has slight contact with the air/fuel mix, however I'm not sure if it would make much difference. I've just been doing what CAM2 does and use JB Weld between the cylinder and the case. I might do an experiment and take some cured copper gasket maker, Yamabond, and JB Weld and soak them in fuel and see how they hold up.
flattie42 is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Pocket Bike Forum - Mini Bikes forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome